Bootstrapping Voron V0.2 r1 LDO kit

[Sojin]

On 9/28/2023 at 6:21 AM, claudermilk said:

I'm at the stage of getting the first layer tuned in, then I'll run through the tuning guide and input shaper myself. First I'm looking over the stock print_start, print_end, cancel, and pause macros. I'm not real happy with how they are working.

I'd be curious to see what you end up doing with your macros. Since we're both running the same hardware, and I have absolutely no idea what I'm doing with macros yet, would love to look over your shoulder as you sort your macros out.

[claudermilk]

I pretty much stole the ones I have on my Trident and tweaked them for the hardware and supporting macro differences. Let me get my Github backup macros & script set up and I'll throw the V0's configs up there too.

[Sojin]

Still loving my V0.2 and been learning a lot about tuning and 3D printing with it. That said, I'm now itching for another build.

I've been going back and forth all weekend adding and removing printers from my Fabreeko shopping cart. I can't decide whether to pull the trigger on a Salad Fork or a 250mm Trident. If I could build a Salad Fork as a 180, this would be a slam dunk. Just not sure if the 160mm build volume is enough, and not sure if I want to deal with a 'big' printer yet. Also, getting a 250 Trident in Space Grey seems like a non-starter short of buying a separate frame kit.

Anyone have any insights or pros/cons with either option? 

[claudermilk]

Well, I started with a 250 Trident. That printer was a great build and it's been a workhorse since then. I can enthusiastically endorse that choice.

[Sojin]

22 minutes ago, claudermilk said:

Well, I started with a 250 Trident. That printer was a great build and it's been a workhorse since then. I can enthusiastically endorse that choice.

Any regrets going with 250 vs a 300? Is the main issue with the bigger printers mostly heat up time?

[claudermilk]

None at all.

[mvdveer]

On 10/12/2023 at 12:27 AM, Sojin said:

ny regrets going with 250 vs a 300?

Built a 250 Trident and it is a great printer.  Currently building a 300. (Was to be a project but that is another story - will post it in a build log)

[Sojin]

I've been happily printing and tuning the last week or two, but I finally sacked up and tore apart my printer long enough to install an MF Nano. I started off trying to print a V6 Nevermore, but the magnet attached Nano won me over. Plus the name. It's a Mother Effin' Nano! lol.

The build was pretty straightforward once I sorted out the magnet pockets. The first couple of fan body section prints I made I managed to split when trying to press in the side magnets. So I broke out a 6mm reamer in a pin vise and reamed some clearance before pressing in the magnets. Worked a treat. Some freshly printed no-drop nuts made mounting the magnet holders to the extrusion a snap as well.

MVP tool of the build:

 

Drilled a hole in the back panel, clipped the JST connector off to thread it through and ran the cable up to an open fan port on the SKR Pico.

All installed!

Had to do some reading in the Klipper documentation to figure out how to actually run the fan. I ended up making a controller_fan entry in the fan section of printer.cfg. I've attached a screenshot if anyone wants to check my work for any glaring discrepancies. I don't think I'm going to burn down the house with anything there. It basically turns the fan on 100% if the bed heater is running. At least that was the intent.

 

Edited October 19, 2023 by Sojin

[Sojin]

Have you ever had the experience of starting a seemingly simple project and having it snowball in to a never ending stream of side projects? Yeah, me too.

Oh sure, things started off innocently enough. "I need to figure out how my start macro works. It'd be really nice to get a nozzle wipe before the print starts." So I started working through Jontek2's "Build a better print start macro" github. (https://github.com/jontek2/A-better-print_start-macro) Step 1, requirements: chamber thermistor.
"Hmm... I've been meaning to get a chamber thermistor, good excuse to do it now." I had Maple Leaf Maker's thermistor holder (https://www.printables.com/model/408760-v0-chamber-thermistor-mount) saved in my "Mods to print" folder so I printed it up and mounted it.

 

"Hmm... Do I have anywhere to plug this in?" No. Guess I'll need to break out that Klipper Expander sooner than later.

 

Guess I'll have to print that cable loom/expander mount now too. 

Edited October 26, 2023 by Sojin
arrange pictures

[Sojin]

Started looking at mounting the newly printed cable loom. "Why is the SKR Pico flopping around?" Apparently the chamber heat over the last couple of weeks was enough to soften up the UHB tape.

"Guess I need to figure out a better mount for the Pico and RasPi." I found a nice DIN rail mount system on Printable's (https://www.printables.com/model/381062-voron-v01-v02-din-rail-board-mounting-system thank you András Bognár), ordered a couple of 8" DIN rails overnight from Amazon and printed it up.

 

The original intent was to mount the Cable Loom to one of the DIN mounts, but the stackup height was too much with the Klipper Expander.

 

So I shamelessly copied @indi8six's electronics DIN rail layout, or at least, that's the intention. I took my flush cutters and chopped out the center 4 loom teeth to make room for the DIN rail.

Got everything laid out and then tried to bolt up the Pico and RasPi to the new mounts. The bolt holes are too big!

The little 2mm self tappers that the LDO kit comes with just slide right through the mount holes on the DIN rail kit. I thought about ordering some 2.5mm hardware, but quickly dismissed that idea. András, being the hero that he is, posted not just the .stl files for his DIN mounting system, but also the .f3d files for remixing and editing in Fusion 360! So with my feeble F360 skills, I managed to edit the mounting holes from 2.7mm to 1.6mm for the self-tappers, and even lengthened the mounting bosses a couple extra mm for some clearance on the back of the Pico and RasPi.

So I found myself last night at 11:30pm, needing to print new parts, with my printer all torn apart. Called it a night. Came home from work today and decided that was enough shenanigans for a build diary update (or 2!)

Now I need to cobble this thing back together long enough to print my parts, so I can tear it back apart and mount the Pico and RasPi on the DIN rail, so I can figure this Klipper expander thing out, so I can mount my chamber thermistor, so I can build a better start macro!

 

 

 

 

Edited October 26, 2023 by Sojin
arrange pictures

[YaaJ]

Why did you add a second chamber thermistor ? Are the readings very different from the Picobilical one ?

[Sojin]

29 minutes ago, YaaJ said:

Why did you add a second chamber thermistor ? Are the readings very different from the Picobilical one ?

I don't know yet. The Picobilical one is a bit shrouded and reportedly is more of an electrical chamber thermistor. The temps always seem to register a bit low. 
I'm curious to see what difference there is, if any, to be honest. It's been a fun project either way.

[YaaJ]

Sorry, my question was stupid. For some reason, I thought the chamber thermistor was on the toolhead PCB. It isn't ! It's on the top PCB, and reports the electronics compartment temperature. Was looking at the schematics while you were answering (GPIO28 / R21)

Of course, it will not report the chamber temp.

On my Zero, I made a back pannel with two fans. I stopped using the fans because they were lowering a lot the "chamber temp" when spinning. Now I understand ! Was thinking the chamber was not airtight enough.

Thanks for opening my eyes. Added the Printables link to the Todo List. Will be done tomorrow.

[Sojin]

Naw, no apologies required. There's no stupid questions here.

Like many of us, I do a ton of reading and research as I plot and plan my upgrades and mods. Reading others' experiences has shaped a lot of my decisions, evidenced by my copying the best ideas I find in my own build. I'm posting the journey and silliness of my Voron build in the hopes that others who read it might find ideas of their own, and that newbies like me might feel like "If THIS clown can do it, I can probably build a Voron myself." And if I can make someone smile along the way, so much the better.  

I've enjoyed following your build and am impressed with your CAD skills and ingenuity of your ideas. 

[claudermilk]

I thought the Picobilical board thermistor was reporting electronics chamber temp as well. I took a really hard look at the LDO board i have and it is in the main chamber (on top of the board); it's right in front of the umbilical cable connectors. That said, as @YaaJ noted it's rather shrouded with the printer mount and it does report high. I intend to look at how to add an adjustment factor & take some chamber temps from my handy multimeter thermistor. The other option is to replicate the above post from @Sojin. 

[YaaJ]

There's a small notch, and the thermistor is exposed to chamber air, right ? Was wondering why this notch !

Assuming there's not huge ground planes and many thermal vias in this area, the PCB should act as a thermal insulator.

I get interesting results. I have two 40mm fans between the motors, that pull air from inside. I don't use them because I had lower readings for the chamber temperature, and everybody was looking happy, with no overheating, just being cooled with convection. But the additional thermistor does show like 5°C more at 50°C. I will update this post after more testing. I didn't note the numbers. Don't remember if the additional thermistors was ginving the higher or lower temp at boot up !

For now, I'd say that an additional thermistor is usefull.

Of course assuming that I properly declared the thermistor ! It is new, and came from Trianglelab a few years ago.

 

[EDIT] added a thermocouple close to the chamber thermistor. Currently :

- Picobilical : 47.4
- Thermistor : 51.8
- Thermocouple : 52

It's even worse with the electronics active cooling : the Picobical temp is going down, while the real chamber temp remains rock steady. Currently a 10°C difference !!!

End of the experiment, I disable the Picobical thermistor, and keep the additional one. It's a one hour mod, and really a usefull one.

Thanks to @Sojin for sharing this mod.

Edited October 27, 2023 by YaaJ

[Sojin]

Currently at work, so just a quick edit of an existing picture. I'll try and grab a better pic when I get home of the Picobilical thermistor.

[Sojin]

41 minutes ago, YaaJ said:

[EDIT] added a thermocouple close to the chamber thermistor. Currently :

- Picobilical : 47.4
- Thermistor : 51.8
- Thermocouple : 52

It's even worse with the electronics active cooling : the Picobical temp is going down, while the real chamber temp remains rock steady. Currently a 10°C difference !!!

End of the experiment, I disable the Picobical thermistor, and keep the additional one. It's a one hour mod, and really a usefull one.

Thanks to @Sojin for sharing this mod.

Okay, now I'm curious, where are you plugging in your extra thermistor? Are you using the LDO kit with the SKR Pico? Or did you get the Picobilical as a standalone kit?
I've run in to some issues with cable loom/Klipper expander print fouling on the USB port of the Picobilical, so looking for another option.

[YaaJ]

Yes, I have the LDO kit, V0.2 s1.

The thermistor is on the 2nd SKR Pico thermistor input : "TH0", that was unused, the hotend being connected to the Picobilical MCU.

[temperature_sensor Chamber]

sensor_type: EPCOS 100K B57560G104F
sensor_pin: gpio27
;pullup_resistor: 2200
min_temp: 0
max_temp: 100
gcode_id: chamber_th

[EDIT] the Picobilical thermistor is the one giving the higher reading when the printer is iddle. By a 6°C.

Edited October 27, 2023 by YaaJ

[Sojin]

You may have just saved me from having to use my crayon-grade F360 skills to try and recreate a shorter version of the cable loom/klipper expander mount my friend! Thank you!

Edited October 27, 2023 by Sojin
spelling

[YaaJ]

Don't you think that LDO should have made 3 ports accessible from the top :

- this thermistor input, free with no onboard sensor
- the two RGB ports

Was about to unsolder the RGB ports and flip them when I realized they would interfere with the A an B nuts.

Too bad they didn't make the Picobilical 100% open source (Kicad project), but we can understand. They probably don't use Kicad. As a company, they probably use Altium or some super professional software...

I recommand this mod also by Mapple Leaf Makers : https://www.printables.com/fr/model/408214-matchstick-diffusers

Had to redesign something similar from what I could easily purchase online, but was worth the effort. Make it. It's a life changer.

 

[Sojin]

42 minutes ago, YaaJ said:

Don't you think that LDO should have made 3 ports accessible from the top :

- this thermistor input, free with no onboard sensor
- the two RGB ports

Was about to unsolder the RGB ports and flip them when I realized they would interfere with the A an B nuts.

Too bad they didn't make the Picobilical 100% open source (Kicad project), but we can understand. They probably don't use Kicad. As a company, they probably use Altium or some super professional software...

I recommand this mod also by Mapple Leaf Makers : https://www.printables.com/fr/model/408214-matchstick-diffusers

Had to redesign something similar from what I could easily purchase online, but was worth the effort. Make it. It's a life changer.

I've had the exact same thought. Why does the Picobilical frame PCB not have a thermistor port in addition or instead of the onboard sensor?
I just got my matchsticks in the mail yesterday, so Maple Leaf's diffusers are on my to-print list. 

[claudermilk]

I came to the same conclusion as @Sojin for there they stuck the thermistor. That notch specifically reveals a surface mount chip, so that's got to be it. I noticed with the printer sitting idle--no print jobs run in a day--and the top hat opened up, it was reading 30C. That's pretty warm, and I know it wasn't that warm in the room, more like 23C give or take. And...LOL, our own @Maurici comes through right here: 

I'll fiddle with that when I have a chance.

For printer lighting, I also have the Maple Leaf Makers parts on the to-print list. I have my Purple Daylight on a Matchsticks sitting here already. Though I might swap them for the RGB Matchsticks later. Because RGB.

 

[Sojin]

I made a thing!
I have aspirations of someday actually being competent in CAD enough to design the ideas in my head. Fusion360 being my weapon of choice in my efforts. The other day I was looking at the little bitty feet that come stock on the V0.2 and thought some bigger, full size rubber feet would be better surely! So I ordered some cheap rubber feet from Mr. Bezos and started plotting how to attach them to my printer. 

Stock feet vs. the new 38mm feet:

The first problem is that the holes on the new feet are 6.5mm (1/4") and the stock feet are using 3mm hardware. So I made a shim that takes up the space and leaves a nice 3mm bore.

 

Then I designed a spacer to adapt the 38mm rubber feet to the stock mounting locations. Initially, I made them so that they socket in to the pocket on the bottom of the V0.2 corner pieces. After printing them up and getting them mounted, I realized that I basically used the space that the bottom plate occupies. Whoops. 

Back to the drawing board. I redesigned the pieces to have a negative space to allow for mounting the bottom cover correctly. 

I have to say, the Bigfoot mod makes a nice difference in stability and personally I like the way it looks. I'm going to try and clean up the .stl's and post this up on Printables if anyone want to try it out. Hardware is just the feet, and 3x25mm hardware. 

 

I had fun thinking through the problem and a solution, and then stretching my meager CAD skills in Fusion to actually drawing it up. Very satisfying!

 

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by Sojin

[Sojin]

Okay, this has been the bane of my existence the last few days. I've been trying to push forward on my Trident build, but I started getting these shutdowns mid-print. I've swapped out every thermistor in the printer, hotend, build plate, and even the chamber thermistor. I've swapped out the Picobilical toolhead board, as well as the frame PCB. I swapped to the brand new Revo hotend from my Trident kit, I've since swapped in a Phaetus Rapido 2.0 with a completely different thermistor type (PT1000) and I'm still getting these errors. At this point, the dashboard in mainsail won't even come up. It immediately fails into this error.

When first got this error, it ended up being the unbiblical cables. I've gone through two of them now. @YaaJ was right, using a strain relief actually made the problem worse. I got 272 hours out of my first umbilical harness, and less than 100 out of the second one that I used strain relief on. I'm on my third harness now, a West3D one and it's still fine. So now this error is coming from something else.

All the googled solutions I've found have not fixed the problem. I'm suspecting it's gotta be wiring related. I'm at my wits end though. Welcoming any suggesions.