Reminder: Abrasive filaments will wear out your nozzle (yes, even if it's a fancy one that is meant to resist abrasion)

[Kyle]

Okay, so I know this is a thing everyone has heard, and generally "gets" but I had to re-learn this lesson today. And maybe this is in the wrong section of the forum, but the frustration I was facing was all around trying to tune ABS on my prusa so I could print my voron 0.1 parts, so maybe it's worth saying if it saves someone else the day of test/calibration prints that make no sense. So, without further ado, here it is:

If you just can't get a new filament tuned (extrusion multiplier, temp, etc) on your "workhorse" printer that you sort of neglect and just throw anything at, maybe check your nozzle? I had a Microswiss hardened plated tool steel nozzle on my prusa mk3 that I've printed countless spools of anything and everything on. I re-learned today (while struggling to get ABS to print cleanly so I can print my parts for a voron 0.1) that just because a nozzle is hard doesn't mean it's impervious to wear. Picture: (left is a new .4 brass nozzle of a different type just to show the reference opening size, middle is my "formerly .4" hardened plated tool steel nozzle, right is a new .8 microswiss hardened plated nozzle).

[mvdveer]

Good lesson, thanks. Something most of us overlook. Thanks for the reminder

[Buurman]

I do change nozzles after a spindle or 10 I think, I only use brass since I have such bad experience with hardened (full steel) ones.

Also... I tried a ruby one, but it broke twice, one time I got send a new, free of charge, second time I didnt bother anymore.

I rather switch out nozzles often than having these kind of issues, that said... printing PC or Carbon stuff.. you probably need hardened, it just EATS up you nozzle.
 

I can advise a good nozzle tool, I love this print and it works wonders... - https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2613057

I printed mine in PLA+ and it clicks on 2.5Nm, what is often a good tension I think.

[Kyle]

1 hour ago, Buurman said:

I can advise a good nozzle tool, I love this print and it works wonders... - https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2613057

Ooh, I like that! I'll have to put it in my "to print" queue!

Someone on the discord suggested I look into tungsten carbide nozzles. I didn't even know they existed, but now I'm considering giving one a try (I had a spare tool steel one that I swapped on when I noticed the issue, but now I need to pick up a new spare, so maybe will do TC this time).

[Stadi]

 

The big problem with the hardened nozzles for carbon is the higher temperature requirement. I've now ordered a nozzle that is made of brass but has an inserted tip made of hardened steel. I'm curious if I can really bring the temperatures down again and how durable it is.

Here is a link to the nozzle: Link

I hope the link is OK, I have nothing to do with the shop other than transfer my money to him 

 

[Buurman]

I hope you have a good experience, I hear bad things about 2 materials nozzles, Mellow's also has something, but I hear they come apart.

I went for a full Tungsten from West3D and yet, costs $50 or so, but it seems to be worth it, they are much harder AND have better heat properties than Brass.
So the best of two worlds, I have now been printing with the 0.6 nozzle for 50/70 hours or so, I see no wear yet.

The 0.4 seems a bit waisted money, since the Carbon I am printing doesnt like a 0.4 nozzle, probably too big parts in there, or something, its really tough stuff...

I am using Extrudr Carbon, it was a mistake of Amazon, who delivered 3 spindles Carbon, while I ordered ASA black. But its twice so expensive so I kept it.

[smirk]

22 minutes ago, Buurman said:

I am using Extrudr Carbon, it was a mistake of Amazon, who delivered 3 spindles Carbon, while I ordered ASA black. But its twice so expensive so I kept it.

Jeff Bezos is barely making ends meet. He's just holding on as a centi-billionaire, he's down to his last $114 billion! Guess on a plus side, if you had highlighted the mistake the Imperial Amazonian Guard would have murdered the poor schlump who made the mistake and you would've got your  ASA and some complimentary severed ears.

[Stadi]

I got my carbon from Princore, they make the nylon themselves, the ASA seems to be from Extrudr, different cardboard, but the same spools.
So far I've been printing with a hardened 0.4 nozzle without any problems. I will report whether the ones used are any good.
Why do you order Extrudr through Amazon and not directly? The price is the same or partially cheaper, there are 20% discount codes online and it's already worth it...

[billbr]

Its not just high content filament that wears your nozzles. Plain ole filament will wear your brass nozzle. I've started replacing my brass nozzles every 30-60 days (depending on printer use) and have had much less challenges due to worn nozzles. In general if the filament starts curling up on a mid-air extrude and the nozzle is known clean, you likely have a worn nozzle.  I print about 100-300 hrs/month on my 2.4 for reference. Also white or anything containing white like gray as well as glow in the dark are more abrasive than other colors.

[claudermilk]

Hmm... I wonder if that's part of my struggle right now. My overhangs and bridges are all borked right now. My nozzle also has over 1000 hours on it. Some glitter and a bunch of white & gray have gone through it.

[smirk]

8 hours ago, billbr said:

replacing my brass nozzles every 30-60 days

Interesting point about white - I print a lot of white and probably end up changing nozzles in a similar time-frame. Although, I never thought of  plain old white filament causing wear (at that rate). Does make me think now, and here was me starting to swither about the notion of getting a REVO but not at a burn rate of £30 every month or two. My wallet thanks you.

[Penatr8tor]

18 hours ago, smirk said:

Interesting point about white - I print a lot of white and probably end up changing nozzles in a similar time-frame. Although, I never thought of  plain old white filament causing wear (at that rate). 

You need to ask yourself... What is the white in white filament? Answer: Titanium Oxide (most of the time) and that stuff is on the level of diamond hard. Another filament with really hard particles that act like sandpaper inside the nozzle is Glow In The Dark. Strontium Aluminate is also very abrasive. 

FWIW... I use Diamondback nozzles. They don't wear out. Ever. All you need is one. Period, End of Story.

Here's my nozzle after printing at least 2-3 spools of white and as many in Glow in the dark. Zero wear after running 3 miles of filament thru it. And don't believe and of that "Oh, It's only a diamond tip and it will come loose and break off BS. I've lost count of how many times I've dragged it along the bed, etc. plus the company that makes these has been making diamond tip drills for industry for the past 30+ years.

[billbr]

@Penatr8tor I've looked at the DiamondBack nozzles and wondered if they were up to the hype. Thanks for the information. I have done nickel-coated copper, hyper-x, and other hardened nozzles, but hated the difference in thermal conductivity and the resulting heat tuning required. I may give DiamondBack a shot.

[Penatr8tor]

10 minutes ago, billbr said:

@Penatr8tor I've looked at the DiamondBack nozzles and wondered if they were up to the hype. Thanks for the information. I have done nickel-coated copper, hyper-x, and other hardened nozzles, but hated the difference in thermal conductivity and the resulting heat tuning required. I may give DiamondBack a shot.

Definitely try one. I can also confirm that with the diamond tip nozzle, you can reduce your print temp ~5c. Also no wear issues with a scrubber brush mod either.

Let us know how it works, should you get one of course.  

[billbr]

Just ordered one from maker3d in Colorado, US.  ~$100 w/o shipping (same price as MatterHackers). I like supporting people that are active in the Voron community.

[Penatr8tor]

@billbr Congrats and I can speak for all of us when I say that we'd really appreciate you sharing your experience with the new nozzle. I hope you're as satisfied as I am with the purchase/upgrade.