Chaotic Lab TAP and Voron/Trident X-Y Endstop

[mvdveer]

Well my very first installation of a printed TAP on the V2.4008 finally started acting up. "Triggered after full movement" error.

Took the toolhead apart and found some of the TAP carriage ball bearings stuck the top of the carriage (4 of them). Wouldn't know how that happened. As I was going to change to the CNC version of TAP (Chaoticlabs), I decided to do it there and then. Now this baby still has the Hartk toolboard and cable chains with traditionaly combined X-Y endstop.

Swapped out the TAP, switched on the printer, confirmed TAP works and...

Did not even give it a second thought and homed the printer - met with grinding and printer complaining loudly - X Endstop not triggered. Obviously not as the CNC version is designed to mount to the endstop on the toolhead. Was going to convert to canbus at some stage which would have forced me to attach and rewire X-Endstop, BUT it was not NOW! (too lazy to take all the wiring apart at 8pm at night)

Luckily found a solution (after 2hours searching, searching, searching...), so I thought I would share for those in the same predicament. Found a "cnc xy adapter", that fits perfectly on the chaoticslab X-endstop switch position. And it works perfectly.

Please note - this is not my design, but a file I found through an extensive search.

I trust someone will find it useful 

CNC_Voron_TAP_XY.stl

[Chuck_Snow]

I do like my Chaotics labs Tap but I would check the screws to the MGNH9  Linear rail, mines came loose even before printing and had no lock tight.. if you get an other one I would check it. I take your other one are fine I hope.. /cross_fingers ...

I wonder if they maybe could of put a more powerful magnet the one on there seams small.

Edited June 6, 2023 by Chuck_Snow

[nickpeck47]

On 6/4/2023 at 10:13 PM, mvdveer said:

Well my very first installation of a printed TAP on the V2.4008 finally started acting up. "Triggered after full movement" error.

Took the toolhead apart and found some of the TAP carriage ball bearings stuck the top of the carriage (4 of them). Wouldn't know how that happened. As I was going to change to the CNC version of TAP (Chaoticlabs), I decided to do it there and then. Now this baby still has the Hartk toolboard and cable chains with traditionaly combined X-Y endstop.

Swapped out the TAP, switched on the printer, confirmed TAP works and...

Did not even give it a second thought and homed the printer - met with grinding and printer complaining loudly - X Endstop not triggered. Obviously not as the CNC version is designed to mount to the endstop on the toolhead. Was going to convert to canbus at some stage which would have forced me to attach and rewire X-Endstop, BUT it was not NOW! (too lazy to take all the wiring apart at 8pm at night)

Luckily found a solution (after 2hours searching, searching, searching...), so I thought I would share for those in the same predicament. Found a "cnc xy adapter", that fits perfectly on the chaoticslab X-endstop switch position. And it works perfectly.

Please note - this is not my design, but a file I found through an extensive search.

I trust someone will find it useful 

CNC_Voron_TAP_XY.stl 222.29 kB · 6 downloads

Hey mvdveer,

I'm working on a trident build, and I ended up going with the Chaotic Lab TAP (latest version) instead of the printed one.  Well wouldn't you know it, with my LDO kit I put the x/y endstop where it's supposed to go and noticed the toolhead isn't even close to hitting that switch...  Is that what this part is for (looks like it)?  Seems like I'm having the exact issue, but wanted to be sure

Thanks

Edited June 25, 2023 by nickpeck47

[mvdveer]

39 minutes ago, nickpeck47 said:

Hey mvdveer,

I'm working on a trident build, and I ended up going with the Chaotic Lab TAP (latest version) instead of the printed one.  Well wouldn't you know it, with my LDO kit I put the x/y endstop where it's supposed to go and noticed the toolhead isn't even close to hitting that switch...  Is that what this part is for (looks like it)?  Seems like I'm having the exact issue, but wanted to be sure

Thanks

That's exactly right. You attach this part to the chaotic lab unit and re-use  the X-Endstop from the original design.

 

Saves you re-wiring a X-endstop from the chaoticslab carriage through the toolhead. (Just uses the existing, mounted endstop)

[nickpeck47]

On 6/25/2023 at 6:02 PM, mvdveer said:

That's exactly right. You attach this part to the chaotic lab unit and re-use  the X-Endstop from the original design.

Saves you re-wiring a X-endstop from the chaoticslab carriage through the toolhead. (Just uses the existing, mounted endstop)

Thanks, I got it working.  Now it seems this tap is triggered every time I query it...  I swear, one thing after another with this build so far lol.  If I hardly touch it, the light dims, knowing it's lifting, but klipper is triggered no matter if it's up or down.  I remember having a like issue with my 2.4 build, but I don't remember what I did to fix it.

Edited June 28, 2023 by nickpeck47

[claudermilk]

You mentioned it being an LDO Trident kit. IIRC, they include the Octopus as the controller board, right? Is the probe connecting to the PB7 port? I ran into that exact behavior rewiring my Trident recently and trying to use the "proper" pin. I moved the sensor wire back to PG15 and it worked correctly again.

[nickpeck47]

2 hours ago, claudermilk said:

You mentioned it being an LDO Trident kit. IIRC, they include the Octopus as the controller board, right? Is the probe connecting to the PB7 port? I ran into that exact behavior rewiring my Trident recently and trying to use the "proper" pin. I moved the sensor wire back to PG15 and it worked correctly again.

Hey claudermilk,

Well, my LDO Trident kit, the "latest" version came with the standard Hartk toolhead, not the two piece LDO toolhead the 2.4 rev C came with.  I had the probe installed into the probe slot, had to redo the wiring vs. what the Chaoticlab manual said because the + and - are different (toolhead side), and it's in the PG15 slot on the Octopus.  I didn't realize this TAP is only 5v, so was the mobo pumping 24v into it? I'm assuming that was the issue, no changes in the printer.cfg would fix it (like adding ~,!,^).  As soon as I swapped it out with my R8 printed version, it works fine (5/24v capable).  Now a new issue is that the printed TAP sensor connector can rub against the cable chain...

I don't know why I keep doing this to myself lol, I love building these things but the stupid issues that's creep up end up costing me patients, time and money.  Plus I now have to decode the problem to where I can't move the bed up or down manually as I get that "out of range 150,150,-15 error.  I can't find the -15 listed anywhere in the cfg file so I'm not sure where that's planted to change it.  I think I had that issue with my 2.4 build but obviously figured it out as it works fine.

UUggghhh.  Sorry, had to say that out loud or else I'll go nuts.  One thing after another with this build so far, always fun!!

Edited June 29, 2023 by nickpeck47

[claudermilk]

It can get frustrating, vent away. We understand and have all been there at one time or another.

For the voltage, it depends on what the J38 block right above J40 was set at--5V, 12V, or 24V. If the jumper is to the edge of the board (nearest the mount hole) you're at 5V; 12V is the middle pins, and 24V is closest to the rest of the ports towards the middle of the board. But I think that's not the problem. The PB7 port is a known problem child; I've never gotten it to work right. As soon as I move the probe signal over to the PG15 pin on STOP_7, it registers correctly. So, a split connector: signal to PG15 on one and ground & power off of the J40 block. It's a little hinkt, but once connected and under the printer who cares.

I don't think you can manually move the bed until you are successfully homed--Klipper doesn't know where the bed is until you do.

BTT put a bunch of information on their GitHub for the Octopus that is very useful. Also throw "Octopus pin diagram" at Google and grab the green diagram image, it's an invaluable guide to the pin IDs.

For the rubbing, I don't have that issue with the 5-24V PCB. The images I see of the 5V one look like it also has the wiring laid along the board. That should not be rubbing--it's close, but not interfering.

Edit: As soon as I hit post I remembered, you are using the Chaotic CNC mount. I wonder if that shifts things enough to cause an issue? I also wonder if that's the case why everyone else using one hasn't run across that & complained. 

[mvdveer]

8 hours ago, claudermilk said:

why everyone else using one hasn't run across that & complained.

Eliminated the cable chain and went canbus with umbilical, so never experienced this. But that's another set of frustrations...

[claudermilk]

 I'll happily deal with getting the cable chain rubbing over the Can(t)bus rabbit hole. For Trident I personally don't care for the idea of umbilical.

[VoronManiac]

I'm building a new 2.4 and configured it for sensorless homing.  Seems reliable enough. Trick was to run a bit faster than stock recommendation to get better back EMF.  The steppers on a COREXY moving in only X or Y run 0.707 times slower than a Cartisean machine which is probably where the stock speed recommendation came from.

Originally concerned about smashing carriage and bits, but it is pretty gentle. 

Best X/Y endstop is no X/Y endstop? 

CAN bus might be fun to play with some day, but I did the math and resized most of the wires in the cable chain to 26awg 19 strand ptfe => cable chains are pretty empty.

[Joshuamcvey]

can anyone link the file op first posted please?

ugh...I dont want an x endstop on my toolhead....I thought chaotic labs tap would work with stock endstops......

[Allofit96]

I thought the same thing. Check out sensorless, it’s not too bad to setup.

 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Allofit96

[Print3D]

Forget the endstops just go sensorless, it's something that is work the tiny bit of tinkering to tune it right

[Rufinus]

Thanks! Exactly was I was looking for... until i dismantle all again for CanBus :)

[DanPin]

I found the file on github...

 

https://github.com/Chaoticlab/CNC-Tap-for-Voron/blob/master/STL/XY_Switch_Adapter/CNC_Voron_TAP_XY_Switch_Adapter_V2.stl